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FZRaven
Activist

Joined: 07 Aug 2007
Posts: 290
Location: Vermont

Posted: Sat May 03, 2008 9:35 pm Post subject:

Vern wrote:

If your kids were misbehaving would it be acceptable for you to throw then in the fire place? Your religion says that if you piss off God your getting tortured for eternity. You Christians are some sick MF's

Guys can we please move away from calling, each other fuckers and so on. There is no problem with having a debate, but if we are going to do so we should try and maintain some sense of civility.

I'm not going to comment on the Old and New testaments. Being an Atheist myself, I don't imagine I could defend the old testament, nor would I want to.

progrocker
Antiprohibitionist

Joined: 13 Jan 2008
Posts: 96

Posted: Sat May 03, 2008 11:36 pm Post subject:

But the OT is such a critical part of the Christian religion. It shows how much BS it all is.

Christianity stems from Judaism. Jesus even said something like, "I am not here to abolish the ways of the old." How could a malicious, spiteful, god turn into a just, loving god who forgives all and loves everyone from one testament to another. It doesn't make sense. Unless you realize that THIS SHIT IS MADE UP.

The Bible has been changed, there is no questioning that. Years of mistranslation leads me to believe that we have no idea what the original bible said.

Putting Christianity on the same grounds as Science is ridiculous. That’s like putting a person who believes in fairies and dragons on equal footing with someone who has a CONCRETE degree, and has made advancements in technology, cured the sick, and seriously helped humanity as a whole.

None of it makes any sense at all. The only way I could see a person believing in it, is if they had been brainwashed into thinking it was true since a very young age.

FZRaven
Activist

Joined: 07 Aug 2007
Posts: 290
Location: Vermont

Posted: Sun May 04, 2008 3:34 am Post subject:

progrocker wrote:

Putting Christianity on the same grounds as Science is ridiculous. That’s like putting a person who believes in fairies and dragons on equal footing with someone who has a CONCRETE degree, and has made advancements in technology, cured the sick, and seriously helped humanity as a whole.

None of it makes any sense at all. The only way I could see a person believing in it, is if they had been brainwashed into thinking it was true since a very young age.

If you are referring to my post, I think you need to read it again. I in know way put science and religion on the same ground. I was merely point out that both sides call the others liars and fools. I also clearly pointed out why Science (to me) is superior to religion.

FZRaven wrote:

Science can incorporate new knowledge into itself as it is discovered, the bible can never be changed. So if any faults are found, they can never and will never be changed. Indeed some people have put forth what they consider faults in the bible, but just because they hold them as such does not mean that everyone holds them as such

While I'm on this, I might as well explain why religion is not a part of science. Science is based on testing, you can not test a god. You can not say God makes the sun go around and prove it, because you can't test god.

I'm not to well versed in the bible, but I'm working to change that.

Also people of faith should remember that the burden of proof is on them, as they make the positive claim. I also leave this for you to ponder.

God is all-powerful, or as theologians put it, “omnipotent”; there is nothing that he cannot do. This is part of the definition of “God”.

So can God create a stone that is so heavy that he cannot lift it? Either he can or he can’t.

If God can’t, then he isn’t all-powerful. If God can’t create a stone that he can’t lift, then there is something that he can’t do: create the stone.

If God can create a stone that is so heavy that he can’t lift it, though, then he also isn’t all-powerful. If God can create a stone that is so heavy that he can’t lift it, then there’s something that he can’t do: lift that stone.

shortyflow
M.I.A.M.I

Joined: 24 Apr 2008
Posts: 587
Location: Porter Pot in Brazil

Posted: Mon May 05, 2008 8:26 pm Post subject:

As a Christian, I believe that i don't worry about hell. If you live how you think God wants you too. Then you will have no problem getting into those gates. Why is there a religion post on here anyway. I believe in forum freedom of speech. but really.

FZRaven. You actually keep it real though. I was not being unpleaseant but a good curse word explains it all. I mean if you were jewish, and someone said not to be, would there be a holocaust? It is beliefs people.... We are on this sight posting and Helping out because we go against others beliefs about smoking dope. It is just beliefs. I just wanna say to end.............PEACE>>>>>then>>>>>POT..........STAY AWAY FROM MICRODOT.. well maybe...

FZRaven
Activist

Joined: 07 Aug 2007
Posts: 290
Location: Vermont

Posted: Mon May 05, 2008 9:02 pm Post subject:

shortyflow wrote:

I do apologize if you thought that post was directed at just at you. I meant it more of a general, lets everyone be nice and avoid nasty name calling. A debate is nice, but your not having a debate if you are yelling obscenities at each other. I don't even care if people swear, to me it's just a word. It's just when people start calling each other names, and directing such animosity towards others.

Hell I go to church more then most religious people I know. I've been going every week for the past few months, I go around to a lot of different churches. I figure if I'm going to have any kind of debate with a person of faith, I ought better know my shit.

socrateez
Stoned Philosopher

Joined: 01 Feb 2008
Posts: 1226
Location: I'm the person to your right.

Posted: Mon May 05, 2008 9:37 pm Post subject:

Quote:

Hell I go to church more then most religious people I know. I've been going every week for the past few months, I go around to a lot of different churches. I figure if I'm going to have any kind of debate with a person of faith, I ought better know my shit.

That's something the religious don't do with regards to science. Ironic?

FZRaven
Activist

Joined: 07 Aug 2007
Posts: 290
Location: Vermont

Posted: Mon May 05, 2008 10:25 pm Post subject:

socrateez wrote:

Quote:

That's something the religious don't do with regards to science. Ironic?

Well you have this one both sides, I know a lot of Atheist that have never so much as browsed Darwin. Not that you must to be an Atheist, most Theists think that the theory of evolution is what all Atheists base their reasoning on. Indeed if these people would take the time and get a basic understanding of evolution, they would learn that evolution does not explain how life started.

And on the same page I know a lot of people who claim to be part of a church and religious, yet have never so much as read the bible. A perfect example is my supervisor, who wanted me to go to a revival. I went and as I thought the guy was a total scumbag, the half hour speech he gave at the end about money sealed that deal. But she bought into everything he said, without questioning anything. Later when I was questioning her on some bible verses Matthew 3:11, in which John baptizes Jesus. To quote John, "I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance". Now Jesus was said to be without sin, so what sins would he need to repent for? Also with what happened, and again I quote the bible Matthew 3:16-18, "16 And Jesus, when he was baptized, went up straightway out of the water: and, lo, the heavens were opened unto him, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove, and lighting upon him: 17 And lo a voice from heaven, saying, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased". Still John did not become a disciple of Jesus who he knew at this point was indeed the son of God, or why did all, or even most of Johns disciples become disciples of Jesus? Indeed most of John followers stayed loyal to him, even in death. In fact a sect of Johns disciples persisted for century's. Of course this does not even take into account Luke, who claims to be chronological (Luke 1:3) who gives the impression that Jesus was not baptized by John. (Luke 3:20-21) At this point she admitted she had never read the bible, because it was to boring.

progrocker
Antiprohibitionist

Joined: 13 Jan 2008
Posts: 96

Posted: Mon May 05, 2008 11:08 pm Post subject:

First of all, your sig is awesome.

Numba 2. It is important to make people aware of behaviors maladaptive to rationality and society.

knowledge and awareness is (almost) never a bad thing. Actions can be bad. I would like to know if they came out with a viable study that showed pot does give you cancer, but even if it was true, I wouldn't recommend banning it. Just like I don't recommend banning religion or telling people what they can or cannot believe. I never did that, I provided an argument.

socrateez
Stoned Philosopher

Joined: 01 Feb 2008
Posts: 1226
Location: I'm the person to your right.

Posted: Tue May 06, 2008 8:37 am Post subject:

Your right about both sides FZRaven! There are the scholarly whom have never read a religious book in their life and yet criticize dogma.
I made it a point to read the Bible entirely and to engage in serious studies from different churches. I ran into the very same thing you are my friend. EVERY Church believes something different because of the person at the pulpits interpretation. There is much overlap of similar doctrine in the Christian churches, but as you are lucidly observing, serious contradiction!
Are you familiar with the Dhammapada?
http://www.serve.com/cmtan/Dhammapada/
Some of Buddha's teachings are eerily similar to Jesus's parables.
What of Noah? Many deluge stories predate the old testament and are regarded as Myth and Fiction.

progrocker
Antiprohibitionist

Joined: 13 Jan 2008
Posts: 96

Posted: Tue May 06, 2008 10:54 am Post subject:

I wonder if it has occured to anyone that if the noah's ark story is true. Then god is worse than hitler.

FZRaven
Activist

Joined: 07 Aug 2007
Posts: 290
Location: Vermont

Posted: Tue May 06, 2008 1:29 pm Post subject:

socrateez wrote:

Yes I am familiar with it, have you seen the movie The Man From Earth? It's an independent film, and I'm not going to give it all away but it has something to do with this.

socrateez
Stoned Philosopher

Joined: 01 Feb 2008
Posts: 1226
Location: I'm the person to your right.

Posted: Tue May 06, 2008 3:07 pm Post subject:

No I haven't seen it, but I read a few reviews since your mention. Sounds right up my alley. Thanx! big grin

This is going on my "to view list".

shortyflow
M.I.A.M.I

Joined: 24 Apr 2008
Posts: 587
Location: Porter Pot in Brazil

Posted: Thu May 08, 2008 7:28 pm Post subject:

progrocker wrote:

I wonder if it has occured to anyone that if the noah's ark story is true. Then god is worse than hitler.

If Noah is true, then as a Christian if it did not happen then I would not be here. i believe the wrong would have taken over, then it would be a matter of time until god would have to start from scratch... speaking of start from scratch.. The Game's-start from scratch song is good. yeah I know random huh my bad.. but to keep on with it, i firmly believe that someone trying to tell me that i evolved from a monkey or a molecule is irrational and kinda stupid. I don't wanna die in the belief that i started from mucus on a rock or something. Give me the belief in God cause just in case some shit is still going on in our minds when we die. then i at least would like to think something is there.

socrateez
Stoned Philosopher

Joined: 01 Feb 2008
Posts: 1226
Location: I'm the person to your right.

Posted: Thu May 08, 2008 7:44 pm Post subject:

shortyflow wrote:

Give me the belief in God cause just in case some shit is still going on in our minds when we die. then i at least would like to think something is there.

What if the afterlife (if there is one) is whatever vision of it you happen to have locked in your head when you die? What if every person gets exactly what they think they will get when they die?
Heaven and Hell for the Christians
Oblivion for the Athiests
The Playboy Mansion for me. big grin

shortyflow
M.I.A.M.I

Joined: 24 Apr 2008
Posts: 587
Location: Porter Pot in Brazil

Posted: Thu May 08, 2008 7:50 pm Post subject:

socrateez wrote:

shortyflow wrote:

Give me the belief in God cause just in case some shit is still going on in our minds when we die. then i at least would like to think something is there.

atheists float around or be ghosts or some other cool shit--- Soc you hit up the girls for me at the Mansion(make sure you put on one of those smoken jackets hugh has).

let me be with my family or better yet with God and my family and some sexy angels. Hell I'll have my Villa De Shorty there for those angels to cause I belive in heaven anythign goes.

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